Make that Apple. I guess I'm epic fail too... XD
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Johnny B
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Comments
Steve Jobbie
I heard of this a while ago but I don't understand why.
Is it money issues? Flash is becoming a bigger and bigger part of the internet, and same with apple and social life (phones and ipods).
Why they can't negotiate is beyond me. I'm too ignorant to look further into this.
Because Flash doesn't run well on Mac computers (especially old ones) and Adobe doesn't do anything about it. It makes Mac computers crash, the games run extremely slow, streaming videos in Flash on a Mac is a pain, etc. Apple blames Adobe for lack of optimization and vice versa. Flash is also extremely "energivorous", hence deemed not suitable for the OS and batteries of phones and other personal devices.
Plus the vulnerability issues...
Yay I got the last quote in the article. :)
When I started with Flash I imagined it might only last a few years. 12 years later, I believe Flash WILL stick around long-term, even if it becomes a niche rather than the mainstream platform. It could very well remain the mainstream, though, if Adobe is aggressive with staying ahead.
Oh! Tom! I totally forgot to write that you participated to this article... and also, I didn't expect you to read my post ;)
I think that valid points were raised in the article.
I wish that Adobe and Apple would just iron out their qualms and work together to present a solid product. However, it seems that the situation will remain unresolved after the fight has been made public.
I am really moved by this topic... Maybe because I am on a Mac platform and therefore too much familiar with the problems of Flash on Mac computers.
On the one hand, as a gamer, working on a Mac might prevent me from a richer web experience if they stop supporting the product.
On the other hand, as a designer, it is alienating to know that you don't reach a full audience as the software becomes less and less universal.
I think there is a slight possibility that Flash could die (not that I want it to) because Apple fanboys will believe anything that Steve Jobs says.
So if he says Adobe is a failed software, they will all believe that Adobe is a failed software.
The idea will probably catch on, but Adobe will never be taken down, IMO.
Yeah. It won't die... but what if you can no longer reach a full audience with it?
I certainly don't want to have to convert my games in multiple platforms just because of this Apple-Adobe war.
Steve did an interview recently that was rather interesting, here's a vague quote from memory:
Steve: Apple is a company that doesn't have as many resources as everyone else in the world, and the way we've succeeded is by choosing which horses to ride really carefully, technically. We look for these technical vectors that have a future and are headed up. And different pieces of technology go in cycles. They have their springs/summers/autumns and then they die out. We try to pick things that are in their springs. and if you choose wisely, you can save yourself an enormous amount of work vs. trying to do everything.
We have a history of doing that, scrapping the 5" floppy disc in favor of the 3.5 floppy disc. And sometimes when we do things like get rid of the 5" floppy people call us crazy! But flash looks like a technology that had its day and is waning, and HTML5 seems like its on its way up, just starting out.
/end quote
the whole video was rather neat, but it kinda made me just think like..Its just a technical descision. Apple doesn't hate flash or anything, they just felt like it was easier than doing all this extra work to make flash work, especially if its going out in the future. (Not that it will, but in their opinion kinda thing you know)
I hope flash stays mainstream, but even if it wins this battle it'll die out eventually. The best way for it's users to keep chugging on is to rely more on talent than what the program can do for you. Otherwise all your merit dies with the program. For instance if a photoshop artist can't draw for shit but he uses lots of filters, and then a new program comes along that's all different and he can't work it, then he's kinda fucked. If the next mainstream animation program had no tweening capabilities (highly unlikely, but for the sake of argument) what would Ebolaworld do? And plus even if your software doesn't die out, the standard of how to use it is always raised, so leaning on the technology as opposed to your own ability won't save you. The flash series 'whirlgirl' was meant to be groundbreaking when it came out, and now if you watch it it's incredibly unsatisfying to watch. I think the gradients were probably what impressed people, I don't know, but the standard of the piece technically doesn't compare to flash nowadays. If the people who made it could scriptwrite or draw nicely, it might have still had a leg to stand on.
Also this all stopped being relevant a while back so I'll shut up.
Johnnybdesign, you incorporated 2 of my main concerns.
I'm currently studying graphic design and i'm considering buying a laptop, so the big Mac vs. PC conflict's running through my head at the moment.
To respond to the fact that Flash is buggy, well, flash projects (from a simple online-ad to a full fledged games like Larry and the Gnomes) are all dependent on the coder. I'm not particularly good at coding, but a guy i work with in summer is ace at writing brilliant actionscrypt which works extremely well.
If flash tends to make a Mac crash, then I'll have to look at windows based laptops, as I think Flash itself is a brilliant tool. You cant design and code a visually-pleasing website in Photoshop alone (you'll only get to the design bit), nor in Dreamweaver (you'll only get the code, and many pretty flat coloured tables) - but in flash, you can design and code a website or game. Nowadays flash is sometimes used to make tv cartoons too. I doubt studios will switch to something new other than Flash or ToonBoom.
Apple's comments and reasons make sense, and I can see exactly why they aren't supporting flash on their mobile and touch screen devices. I don't think flash will be going away any time soon. For playing videos and things like that, HTML5 ftw. I'm happy to see HTML5 replace flash in that area. Flash will still be the major platform for silly little games that people play in their lunch break. There's no other platform that is as easy to make games on yet. It will probably still reign supreme for random little animations too, at least for a while. Game developers have nothing to worry about though, unless they want to make iPhone/iPad games.
In my opinion the only way HTML5 is totally going to totally take down flash is if someone creates a viable authoring tool to replace it. HTML5 is fine as a coding language, I don't care if I program in HTML5 or AS, but nobody has been able to produce a comprehensive workspace that works as well as flash does. Could you imagine trying to lip sync an entire animated sequence for your game using no movie clips and only code? I can't even comprehend it. Luckly I hear that Adobe is working on some HTML5 authoring tools, so we may end up with something as easy to use as flash for alternate languages, so it doesn't seem like Adobe is going to be knocked out of the ring any which way.
just when im almost done learning as3 *sigh*
This better not be like Twilight.
I love how Apple is all about the future of technology, what's going to be big in the market, and open standards, etc. and yet, their OS has garbage for marketshare, and all of their stuff is proprietary to it. It's only very recently that OSX even runs on an intel platform. They complain about flash being a proprietary standard not working very well on their proprietary OS. Yeah, no one cares about Macs, because they have negligible marketshare.
TEAM ADOBE
google are supporting adobe and the latest flash versions will be shipped with android software
I definately read that somwhere
you can now create (quite easily) iphone and iPad apps with the flash ipod bundler in cs5 you just need to pull out some technical wizardy in order to do this
I most certainly don't think flash is dying the standard of animation and games along with the possibilities of AS3 and new tools which are developed for flash
are key elements in this
I believe the key reason apple are doing this is because if flash is available on the iPad and iPods why would you bother downloading apps which cost money (certain games etc.) when you can get these games and apps for free (on sites like newgrounds etc.) and play them using the flash player on your ipad?
this would lose lots of money for apple and alot of developers I do see the logic behind apples policy but it's a bit of a dick move and has given google a huge advantage!
rant over
Flash won't "die." Even if Adobe one day decided Flash was obsolete, for whatever reason, Flash movies and games will continue to thrive. Plus Flash 8 is the best version anyway.
Kajenx
Lol, I think it's more like Adobe is epic fail. Flash isn't dying anytime soon.